UK theme parks from another point of view!

 
filmAlive
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Re: SW8

Thu Sep 17, 2015 11:33 am

Something that might be of interest in todays trading update Merlin have highlighted their capex plans for the next 2 years, 2016 as we know for the RTG (Resort Theme Park Group) the high investment is at Thorpe Park, however 2017 no longer mentions Alton Towers, it covers Heide Park and Chessington, meaning SW8 may be delayed to 2018...
 
Aidan Lowe
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Re: SW8

Thu Sep 17, 2015 2:30 pm

Wouldn't be surprised at that to be honest. Nick Varney said next year they don't expect visitor numbers to return, need to lay off staff to a degree as well. I think they just want to get some stability back and when plans for a new coaster come media will no doubt be all over it: "Death Trap coaster to be built next at AT?"
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filmAlive
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Re: SW8

Thu Sep 17, 2015 3:25 pm

Completely agree, I think they will assess the market conditions next year to see if it should signs of recovery once The Smiler re-opens, and gauge the best time to then announce something big. I can see 2018 being the date now.

I believe they will open something new next year, just to help with the recovery, but it will be something low budget like a new flat.
 
Aidan Lowe
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Re: SW8

Thu Sep 17, 2015 3:49 pm

Indeed they desperately need something apart from another CBeebies Land extension. A new medium investment flat would be lovely although I'm leaning more them getting one in 2017 now and just focusing on the Air improvements, roller coaster restaurant and hotel extension for 2016?
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xylyx
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Re: SW8

Thu Sep 17, 2015 3:57 pm

They do need something new, Smiler being out of action this season means it will almost feel fresh to ride again next season.
However folks have ridden every ride more times than they can believe with the low park capacity and a reopened Smiler coupled with a flat and, if they do a good job, the air refresh might be enough to get people heading back more than once or twice :)

Still hoping for that 2017 opening for SW8 :)
 
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NemesisRider
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Re: SW8

Thu Sep 17, 2015 4:10 pm

I'm going to bet SW8 goes ahead as normal in 2017, possibly with a May opening. Why else would they submit hotel plans for 2017, especially when they've just opened The Enchanted Village? Probably to house the higher guest numbers staying overnight when SW8 opens or to push overnight stays whilst many people have new reason to visit the resort.

I could be wrong but it would make sense, what will draw people back is a big new ride.
 
Aidan Lowe
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Re: SW8

Thu Sep 17, 2015 4:13 pm

NemesisRider wrote:
I could be wrong but it would make sense, what will draw people back is a big new ride.


For enthusiasts and people who can bypass the Smiler incident yes, but for the majority of the GP it won't. People who don't visit parks regularly or understand this is a very rare occurrence will not be told differently, they will keep their mindset and stick to it. However time is a great method, over time people forget.
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Ryan.B
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Re: SW8

Thu Sep 17, 2015 4:22 pm

Let's remember, they class different things as high investment. For Merlin I would say 1-5million is low, 5-12 medium (somewhere in between CBeebies land was around 8-10 million I think, that was classed as medium I believe) and 12-25 million is high, with above that just being near the top for Merlin. For all we know, SW8 was not listed high investment, it was listed major. Wooden coasters are major rides, which can be amazing at lower costs. I reckon a few cuts to theming and the total ride, then to be reaching completion the year after. Outlaw run which looks amazing only cost 10 million dollars which is around £6, 447, 000 which would be quite small on cost for Merlin, so depending on whether major necessarily means high cost. Major investment and high investment can be different. Major doesn't have to mean costs a lot. Outlaw run is a terrain coaster, like sw8 should be. I reckon the money saved from it not being an high investment will be invested it to a world class dark ride in 2020. If they don't build sw8 in 2017 they may have to delay 2020's investment, which could have an impact with paramount likely opening, more people would probably go there if it opened before the after '2017' major investment. I would put money on it going ahead in 2017 to be honest, although I don't have any of that to start with :lol
 
charlie_ball10
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Re: SW8

Sun Sep 20, 2015 12:30 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smBNL4ClTR0

Something like this for the area around Katanga Canyon?
PLEASE
Nemesis x10 in 30 minutes on 2/5/15
 
mark_h
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Re: SW8

Sun Sep 20, 2015 7:24 pm

Ryan.B wrote:
Wooden coasters are major rides, which can be amazing at lower costs. I reckon a few cuts to theming and the total ride, then to be reaching completion the year after. Outlaw run which looks amazing only cost 10 million dollars which is around £6, 447, 000 which would be quite small on cost for Merlin, so depending on whether major necessarily means high cost. Major investment and high investment can be different. Major doesn't have to mean costs a lot. Outlaw run is a terrain coaster, like sw8 should be.


There is not a direct link between ride cost and satisfaction. I suspect that by chasing "world's firsts" the resulting rides end up more expensive and not necessarily as good to ride.

A (relatively) low cost but impressive ride may be what the park needs to recover from the Smiler incident and draw back customers.

I am not suggesting that Merlin switch to buying only generic rides as that would not be a good move as many of them do not have the capacity required by a larger park (for example Octonauts).
 
Ryan.B
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Re: SW8

Mon Sep 21, 2015 2:19 am

Anyone know the capacity on RMC'S? I have seen low capacity on some wooden coasters (cu chulainn, which is a reasonably long length GG coaster is around 750pph. Not sure about RMC'S though. What is intriguing me is Alton are not listed for high/major investment in the recent Merlin plans thing (forgotten what it's called :lol ) and instead Chessington and Heide park are. This makes me wonder what Chessington could be getting (I think family launch is possible, but that's for another topic.) and also Heide park. What is making me think is SW8 may have changed plans (I doubt it, still believe it will happen, as a wooden coaster in 2017)... But is it really a coincidence that RMC'S released a new track style, that could go very well at Alton in the terrain and with less supports, plus it could have a lot more to it. I'm starting to wonder if Alton were talking to RMC about a wooden coaster, but then this popped up and they entered talks about this (what I think is) a worlds first style coaster, that is world class, not just a gimmick. RMC have said they were talking to select few parks, and I think Alton could be one of them, and if it does turn out SW8 has been pushed back, I think the single track concept could be for sw8! It's all a bit strange with these changes...
 
Aidan Lowe
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Re: SW8

Mon Sep 21, 2015 5:49 am

I'm just gonna put this here as there isn't any topic relating to RMC exclusively etc. So a few days ago lewis I think it was showed us the Coaster Force exclusive of the single rail track design RMC is doing a mock up of. Interestingly in this video he mentions they already have clients interested. SW9?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uO9I2O40Xlc
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Ryan.B
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Re: SW8

Mon Sep 21, 2015 8:02 am

There's a chance plans for SW8 have changed, with chessington and heide park listed as high investment in 2017, so it could be they were interested in this more, this could be what they want for SW8 .
 
JonDoesTT
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Re: SW8

Mon Sep 21, 2015 8:14 pm

I would much rather have an amazing ride with good duration, good theming, good layout, etc, than have a 'world record breaking' coaster. If they can do all of the above and make it a record breaking coaster, like The Smiler managed to do, it would be fantastic. I'm not saying the record breaking coasters are bad, we all love them, but I'm just saying that they could do something much much better without having it be a record breaker.
Image

Credit to NemesisRider
 
Aidan Lowe
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Re: SW8

Wed Sep 23, 2015 5:14 pm

So here is a prototype I haven't heard much about. It's the S&S Free Fly X (extreme), basically a 4D coaster which goes side to side (and over) rather than the current 4D ones. Alton Towers can't go too high so something like this would give maximum thrill while not necessarily being too high. Unlikely to happen but one can always hope for something like this for the future.

Image

Image
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allijukes19
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Re: SW8

Thu Sep 24, 2015 7:01 pm

I think they will go ahead with there 2017 investments! Heide Park though got a new coaster in 2014, I would of thought that it would be getting a new ride in 2018 rather than Alton Towers that should be getting one in 2017 (If we look at the four year rotor system)
 
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daveclarkedaveclarke
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Re: SW8

Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:48 pm

All gone very quiet in here, when do we guesstimate we will hear some solid news?
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SJW
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Re: SW8

Fri Oct 16, 2015 3:04 pm

^ Hopefully December/January!
 
Ryan.B
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Re: SW8

Fri Oct 16, 2015 3:19 pm

Thinking back, chessington having a major 2017 investment does NOT mean SW8 is delayed, 2013 was a high investment season for both chessington (zufari) and Alton (The Smiler) I'm sure plans have been made, but are,just being revised. This is just speculation, not truth. I think if burger kitchen and The blade are still there in 2016, then SW8 will have been delayed, but if any removals are made in forbidden valley then it would be delayed. (Still think it's going prospect tower restoration is a way to ease the chances it gets permission I think.) if it doesn't go ahead and there is no thrill ride in the next 2 years, then it will have been 5 years since the last thrill ride. There is nothing to draw thrill seekers in the last 2 years, it can't go 5 years without a new thrill ride, yes the older rides may be the best, but people have already ridden them, the GP come to go on the big new shiny thrill ride, which at the moment they can't, because the newest is closed, and the 2nd newest is 5 years old. Alton has invested again, and again in thrill rides every few years, it is unusual for a park in this country, but Thorpe have been doing the same, Thorpe and Alton have been installing rides so often, people expect them to get a new ride every year and when they don't people moan, but when they do they end up flopping and not being at a high standard (see I'm a Celebrity) if you look at parks like Blackpool, they can afford to not keep investing, because people are used to it, but Alton can't afford to go so long without investment. There NEEDs to be a new thrill ride in the next few years.
 
ASturge21
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Re: SW8

Sat Oct 17, 2015 9:47 pm

We can hope to hear something over the closed season but I would not expect many details.

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