UK theme parks from another point of view!

 
Dave

Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Tue Jan 17, 2012 9:39 pm

This all seems to make sense to me. Sure having two rides closed for the season is a bit rubbish but from a logistical point of view it makes sense, the access gates at the bottom of X-sector are the only real site access to the proposed ride area, they did the same to Ug land when Rita was built, and Th13teen for that matter. 

and if the closure is due to cutbacks then surly seeing two rides that are either aging or just plain rubbish is better then seeing more money taken from other areas of the park, how would people react if the saved Ents and subs but had to cut back on the licenses for music in the rest of the park, be like 2007 all over again!!
 
Jordan

Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Tue Jan 17, 2012 9:47 pm

In terms of the wider general public, I don't see how it would benefit the park to open the rides for the best part of 2 months in the season, as construction is rumoured to start somewhere around early summer if planning consent is given. Opening the rides for even a small portion of the season would involve adding them to the map which, in the long run, just confuses guests and leaves them disappointed.

If they're both not open for the entire season and if park promotional material doesn't even mention it, then guests who are unfamiliar with the park will likely be less disappointed than if they expected the rides to be open.
 
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Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Tue Jan 17, 2012 10:14 pm

The more I think about this, the more I side with OldGitBen that closing these rides is unacceptable.  Lisa's cousin is not tall enough for the 1.4 Meter rides but can get on Submission and Enterprise, and that will be two less rides for him to go on this season.  We are hoping he reaches the 1.4 meter mark some point this year.

Just because they have this lovely new 2013 Roller-coaster does not mean we should have this used as an excuse, or seen as a reason to accept the rides being closed because it means we get a new roller-coaster.  It is not acceptable in this day and age that they can not work out a solution to build the new ride while keeping these attractions open.

We already moan about Oblivion, Nemesis, Air, and others need touching up, and giving some TLC and we just brush it off, as if to say, well,  if they had the money they would do it, or if they spend the money sorting the air tunnel and re-painting it, we would not be getting NTS so its okay for the Air Tunnel to stay a mess 10 years after it opened. 

Are we going to start saying, you know what,  its okay for Alton Towers to close Ripsaw and Blade during 2013 because they are going to use the money to repaint Air and sort the tunnel out.

Its not for me to say how Alton Towers should keep these rides open, but not even making an effort to keep them open is just poor, and having the cheek to put the price up when you are reducing the number of attractions is just wrong.  In my opinion it all points to it being of a financial motivate to keep these rides closed.  Looking at Google maps, you can easily keep Submission open and move Enterprise somewhere else for the season.

You can't help but wander how Merlin have let these parks fall in to such a poor state, that they are willing to let rides stay closed and unavailable for an entire season just because it makes the parks life a little easier.

Ian
 
Blaze

Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Tue Jan 17, 2012 10:21 pm

Jordan wrote:
In terms of the wider general public, I don't see how it would benefit the park to open the rides for the best part of 2 months in the season, as construction is rumoured to start somewhere around early summer if planning consent is given. Opening the rides for even a small portion of the season would involve adding them to the map which, in the long run, just confuses guests and leaves them disappointed.

If they're both not open for the entire season and if park promotional material doesn't even mention it, then guests who are unfamiliar with the park will likely be less disappointed than if they expected the rides to be open.

Think I agree with this. If they clearly state that the rides are closed for construction and that they'll be open again next year, it will be less badly recieved than if they faffed around adding it for a couple months then removing it from the line-up.
 
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Jiminy Cricket
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Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Tue Jan 17, 2012 10:32 pm

I'm a little confused guys.  Are they getting rid of them completely for something new for 2013?  Or are they just closing them for a year and re-opening them in 2013?
Last edited by Jiminy Cricket on Wed Jan 18, 2012 1:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
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Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Tue Jan 17, 2012 10:42 pm

It could be also a bit of both, they may need access to the site and instead of closing the rides when the need arises they're doing it from the off which is bad and lazy really.

Either way, they're no great loss to most of us and at least they're not closed indefinitely but I guess that's not the point. Let's hope there's work going on around the area from the off otherwise Alton are going to start the season with a lot of complaining. 
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Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Tue Jan 17, 2012 10:48 pm

I love that whatever work is done all season, it will be in perfect view from oblivions drop. :)
What he said.
 
Poison Tom 96

Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Tue Jan 17, 2012 11:15 pm

Jiminy Cricket wrote:
I'm a little confused guys.  Are they getting rid of them completely for something new for 2013?  Or are they just closing them for a year and re-opening them in 2013?

They will be SBNO 2012 and hopefully back 2013
 
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Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Tue Jan 17, 2012 11:25 pm

Blaze wrote:
Jordan wrote:
In terms of the wider general public, I don't see how it would benefit the park to open the rides for the best part of 2 months in the season, as construction is rumoured to start somewhere around early summer if planning consent is given. Opening the rides for even a small portion of the season would involve adding them to the map which, in the long run, just confuses guests and leaves them disappointed.

If they're both not open for the entire season and if park promotional material doesn't even mention it, then guests who are unfamiliar with the park will likely be less disappointed than if they expected the rides to be open.

Think I agree with this. If they clearly state that the rides are closed for construction and that they'll be open again next year, it will be less badly recieved than if they faffed around adding it for a couple months then removing it from the line-up.


I also agree with this.  PLUS, we're expecting Black Hole Tent deconstruction to be starting very early in the season, so (de)construction is basically starting straight away.  This way, from the outset, they can put up nice big (hopefully themed) fencing closing the whole area off and get on with work, without constantly worrying about access. 

In terms of the GP, it's better to not advertise the rides, not feature them on the map, leave them out of fast track and keep them hidden away, rather than promote them, but have them closed at various points of the year to facilitate site access.

Also, don't forget that with N:ST, we'll only be one flat ride down on last year, and if N:ST is as good as it seems, it'll be far better than Submission and Enterprise put together.  And probably soak up more queues than Enterprise and Submission put together did last season.
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AshleeK
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Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Tue Jan 17, 2012 11:36 pm

In a way, I want to miss the rides this season. I don't really like rides being SBNO, because it's like the park is telling me that I'm not allowed to ride them (I know technically they are, but hopefully you know what I mean). But then I remembered that Submission is rather painful, and Enterprise isn't exactly the most thrilling ride in the world. Still, it's a shame.
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Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Wed Jan 18, 2012 12:10 am

It is a shame about enterprise being closed for 2012, I usually go on it at last once. Always good fun! Dont really care for Submission.

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CoasterCrazyChris
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Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Wed Jan 18, 2012 12:12 am

Jiminy Cricket wrote:
I'm a little confused guys.  Are they getting rid of them completely for something new for 2013?  Or are they just closing them for a year and re-opening them in 2013?


Apparently they are only SBNO for 2012 while construction work takes places on Secret Weapon 7.

But I have a feeling they might make the decision not to reopen them in 2013 over the course of the next year...

Only time will tell.
 
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Nightfall
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Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Wed Jan 18, 2012 11:59 am

For the first time since I joined TTF I’ve just skim read through an entire topic. Honestly half the stuff that’s been posted in here has just been unconstructive moaning before anything was actually known, and this was only 2 days ago! As for arguing with an obvious PBB Troll; he always turns up when Towers announce bad news but I notice he was absent when SW7 was unveiled. If he’s not going to engage in proper discussion then don’t rise to his bait. And please remember to read the topic title as it clearly states SBNO for 2012 not closed for good! [/rant]

Now here are my thoughts:
2 ride’s SBNO for a whole season is not good. Why they need so long I’m unsure, a few months near the start (for excavation) and a month when the track arrives would surely suffice. Is there an alternative motive? Probably

But let’s be honest as long as it is just for one year the rides in question are not going to be missed. I’ve read more moaning about the state of these two rides than just about any other attractions at the park. Nemesis Sub-Terra will (for us enthusiasts at any rate) be a worthwhile addition to make up for these two missing rides and then next year all 3 will be running. If they make their 2013 reappearance with a brand new look then that just sweetens the deal.

So just to clarify while this is by no means good news I think we can live with these rides closure for 1 year. This is pretty bad news for anyone under the 1.4 meter mark although I’ve always thought Alton to be lacking for this height range anyway.
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Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Wed Jan 18, 2012 12:44 pm

I for one am very disapointed about Enterprise being SBNO for the season, ever since I started visiting the park back in 2004, and since then I've visited every few months during the main season, Enterprise has always been my first ride of the day, and I have many rerides during the day, in 2012 without it my visits will seem strangly empty, and my first ride of the day will be Oblivion before heading to Hex, if Oblivion wasn't such a fantastic ride I would seriously consider not going into X Sector, and I think a lot of the GP will think that way too.

Submission on the other hand, I went on it once on my first visit, and its the only ride I have ever been on which I have disliked, so I won't be missing that one...
 
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Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Wed Jan 18, 2012 1:42 pm

If this is the case then surely the entrance fee shouldn't be increased for 2012. Very strange decision for a park which considerably lacks flat rides...
 
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Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Wed Jan 18, 2012 1:59 pm

Nightfall wrote:

Now here are my thoughts:
2 ride’s SBNO for a whole season is not good. Why they need so long I’m unsure, a few months near the start (for excavation) and a month when the track arrives would surely suffice. Is there an alternative motive? Probably



Alternative motive! I don't think so!

As i have said before the site access is behind the two rides so they cant just open and close the rides every time they need to get access to the SW7 site, the site access is the entrance to a secure site so the public cannot access it. Its basic site health and safety! They cant erect fencing and then take it down every time then need to get equipment, materials, etc from the x-sector access to the sw7 site. This would waste time and money so what Alton are doing and really they don't have any other choice is have the x-sector access and the site entrance which means the two rides fall under the site area which means no public access during construction.
 
Nathan
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Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Wed Jan 18, 2012 2:08 pm

Enterprise will be ready to open on March 24th.

Submission has a five month wait for a new part (from December).

They won't be closed for the 2012 season in its entirety, only when SW7 construction gets underway.
Last edited by Nathan on Wed Jan 18, 2012 2:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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Nightfall
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Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Wed Jan 18, 2012 3:25 pm

Mattchu_19 wrote:
Nightfall wrote:

Now here are my thoughts:
2 ride’s SBNO for a whole season is not good. Why they need so long I’m unsure, a few months near the start (for excavation) and a month when the track arrives would surely suffice. Is there an alternative motive? Probably



Alternative motive! I don't think so!

As I have said before the site access is behind the two rides so they cant just open and close the rides every time they need to get access to the SW7 site, the site access is the entrance to a secure site so the public cannot access it. Its basic site health and safety! They cant erect fencing and then take it down every time then need to get equipment, materials, etc from the x-sector access to the sw7 site. This would waste time and money so what Alton are doing and really they don't have any other choice is have the x-sector access and the site entrance which means the two rides fall under the site area which means no public access during construction.


That's assuming they will constantly need to accessing the ride through the day. For most theme park projects the diggers and other equipment will remain on that plot of land during opening hours so an access route is not required to be open all the time. All they need to do is build the fences around SW7, then when the park is closed open the gate for equipment to come through (which won’t be needed that often) This of course is excluding the times when they are bringing track on site and stuff like that but as I said (and Nathans post above suggests) the entire area can be closed off at a point midway through the year. To close the site for an entire year is unnecessary and if they’re going to do so I think there could be another reason why there doing this. If Submission is waiting for a new part anyway then that could be the other reason.
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Poison Tom 96

Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Wed Jan 18, 2012 3:36 pm

What is it with these conspiracy theories? Why would Merlin try them on? Can't we just accept it is probably - i wager - just for site access. As it has been mentioned the site needs to be secure and that half opening will confuse guests


I sense there is a lot of Merlin bashing for the sake of bashing going on
 
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Mattchu_19
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Re: Submission & Enterprise: Closed (SBNO) for 2012

Wed Jan 18, 2012 4:25 pm

Nightfall wrote:
Mattchu_19 wrote:
Nightfall wrote:

Now here are my thoughts:
2 ride’s SBNO for a whole season is not good. Why they need so long I’m unsure, a few months near the start (for excavation) and a month when the track arrives would surely suffice. Is there an alternative motive? Probably



Alternative motive! I don't think so!

As I have said before the site access is behind the two rides so they cant just open and close the rides every time they need to get access to the SW7 site, the site access is the entrance to a secure site so the public cannot access it. Its basic site health and safety! They cant erect fencing and then take it down every time then need to get equipment, materials, etc from the x-sector access to the sw7 site. This would waste time and money so what Alton are doing and really they don't have any other choice is have the x-sector access and the site entrance which means the two rides fall under the site area which means no public access during construction.


That's assuming they will constantly need to accessing the ride through the day. For most theme park projects the diggers and other equipment will remain on that plot of land during opening hours so an access route is not required to be open all the time. All they need to do is build the fences around SW7, then when the park is closed open the gate for equipment to come through (which won’t be needed that often) This of course is excluding the times when they are bringing track on site and stuff like that but as I said (and Nathans post above suggests) the entire area can be closed off at a point midway through the year. To close the site for an entire year is unnecessary and if they’re going to do so I think there could be another reason why there doing this. If Submission is waiting for a new part anyway then that could be the other reason.


Yes the diggers will be left on site but what about deliveries, cement trucks for the foundations, slabs, etc also you have the ground works which involves moment of top soil etc.  I work within the construction industry and during these stages of any project there will be vehicles coming and going all day. Yea there will be some days where the access wont be used a lot but it will still need to be used.

The two rides are closed for the construction of SW7! Simple! No other reason! Its also so Oblivion can still operate. If for some reason the access is needed during the day because time-scales of project change daily and the access to the sw7 site is not fenced off they would have to shut all of x-sector. How do you tell people that some days Oblivion could be closed but we don't know which days! I would be annoyed if i turned up to find Oblivion was open the day before but not the day im there! Also yea Submission might be waiting for a new part but why close the other ride? Makes no sense lol

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