UK theme parks from another point of view!

 
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Themeparksandy1981
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Wed Aug 12, 2015 5:53 pm

oliverfox wrote:
Altontowersbarlow wrote:
I have no idea when or if The Smiler will re-open, however the decision can not be made either way until HSE have deemed the ride to be safe and a full report detailing and explaining the incident is released. I am sure that Alton Towers will continue to deal with the situation as professionally and appropriately as they have been doing, however it is not in their hands at this point.

My personal opinion is that the ride should re-open, however when is at the discretion of the park and HSE.



The fact of the matter is, the Smiler is a safe ride. It would never even have been opened if it wasn't safe. I really hope the length of this investigation isn't distorting people's perceptions of this ride, because as with every other roller coaster in the world, they're safer than cars, planes, parachutes… etc… this was merely a fluke accident. HSE will consider if the same set of circumstances will be repeated, and the steps to take to completely eliminate this. They will simply be looking for that extra level of safety. NV's interview with Kay Burley does (unnecessarily repeatedly) go on about how the rides were 'not safe enough', but it's like looking at a crossroads, and asking why every single crossroads is not traffic-light controlled to allow just one direction to travel at once. Sure it's obviously safer, but it's really unnecessary. If the report comes back human error, I suspect HSE will want to remove that human intervention power, and hand 90% of the operating control over to the ride, as when running properly, machines are more reliable than humans.


You can't say the Smiler is safe with the number of problems it had for the past 2 years.
I always thought if they had started straight away from the moment the black hole tent was removed then they wouldn't have rushed it. All the other SW coasters were started during the closed season 16 months before the coaster opened. By the start of the 2012 season the Black Hole tent was still up.
I think it's in the last chance saloon so they won't open it to all the troubles are sorted like the stalling. Then from day 1 of reopening the media gonna be at the park with the protesters. Also it's gone quiet in the news as the footie season started again so that's taken centre stage. I think even if they do open it again this season it won't get the crowds back thought the gates and there lucky there owned by the 2nd biggest company in the world as theses loses would have made the park drop prices.
 
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lewis97
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Wed Aug 12, 2015 6:07 pm

The prohibition notice served against Alton Towers/Merlin Entertainments is now visible on the HSE website here.
Description
A risk of serious personal injury, and that the matter which will give rise to the said risks are, the failure to prevent cars on the ride colliding with each another and that the said matters will involve contravention of the folllowing statutory provisions. You have failed to prevent cars on the ride from colliding, which has resulted in serious injuries to members of the public

It could be assumed that this means that, as expected, Alton Towers will only be able to operate The Smiler again once they've proved that it is impossible for such an issue to repeat itself. The time scale of this will be dependent on the HSE investigation establishing the cause and where changes need to be made.
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xylyx
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Wed Aug 12, 2015 6:31 pm

That's interesting to read, I do hope they're someway towards finding out what happened.

The media coverage has been quiet for a while, only the Mirror still reports the inanity.And the comments on fb suggest folks are sick of hearing it. I would be very very surprised to see protesters when it opens, there are far bigger problems in the world and not many will pay the entry price just to stand and complain about one ride.

I have no doubt there will be raised voices, but I suspect they will be in the minority.
 
Ryan.B
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Wed Aug 12, 2015 11:36 pm

Won't there always be the risk of that happening if on more than 1 train, the only way I see around it is a maximum of 3 train operation, or/as well as only dispatching a train when one leaves the 2nd break run. I don't see many other ways for it to be impossible. Could this be why rattlesnake is still closed, due to them having multiple cars on the circuit at all times? It probably won't ever happen again, but they'll pretty much always have a risk of it happening.
 
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:02 am

Ryan.B wrote:
Won't there always be the risk of that happening if on more than 1 train, the only way I see around it is a maximum of 3 train operation, or/as well as only dispatching a train when one leaves the 2nd break run. I don't see many other ways for it to be impossible. Could this be why rattlesnake is still closed, due to them having multiple cars on the circuit at all times? It probably won't ever happen again, but they'll pretty much always have a risk of it happening.


I agree that the only way to totally eliminate this risk is to take away multi car operation. This will inevitably cause queues that will probably exceed 3 to 4 hours, but without convincing HSE that their new software is absolutely fail safe (which, may I add, is unlikely as teething issues will undoubtedly become apparent the more the system is tested in different scenarios. Tried and tested methods are much more relied upon). That is, unless they simply implement a higher level of machine autonomy, as I suggested previously.
 
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:09 am

I'd imagine it would work a little like a risk assessment, where they start by determining the "scenario", then giving the severity and the likelihood a rating out of 10. They then work on an action plan to reduce to likelihood to an amount that they deem safe. It'll be all about coming to a reasonable agreement with HSE.
to use a real life example...
Risk off Falling off a Ride platform - You could reduce this by installing railings. But there's still a tiny risk you could lose balance and fall over the railing. You could reduce the risk of that happening by making harnesses mandatory. You then still have a risk of falling off and the harness failing, but lets say the platform is very low, and risk of death is unlikely, they will probably deem that safe enough.
 
Sentri558
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:03 pm

Remember how there was an issue with the car sensors (allegedly)? Possibly just E-stop and don't run the ride if there's any such issue in the future. Wouldn't remove the possibility but would help a lot.
 
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Altonboy001
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Thu Aug 13, 2015 1:36 pm

its human error they put people on while the ride was still in maint.mode
 
xylyx
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Thu Aug 13, 2015 1:41 pm

I should imagine when they get it back up and running again they will be hyper vigilant about cars on the track and the batwing will be the most scrutinised section.
 
Sentri558
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Thu Aug 13, 2015 2:04 pm

Thinking about the batwing, is it possible for mini "boosters" to be added after the trim brakes on Gerestlauer infinities?

I mean, you could just lower the trim brakes, but then you run the risk of being too fast. Idk, I'm just obsessed with the idea of boosters.
 
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Dan
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Thu Aug 13, 2015 2:16 pm

Altonboy001 wrote:
its human error they put people on while the ride was still in maint.mode


While this is one of the speculated causes of the crash, nothing has yet been released by Merlin or the HSE so to say "it was this" or "it was that" at this point would be guesswork :)
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Altonboy001
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Thu Aug 13, 2015 3:41 pm

Dan.N wrote:
Altonboy001 wrote:
its human error they put people on while the ride was still in maint.mode


While this is one of the speculated causes of the crash, nothing has yet been released by Merlin or the HSE so to say "it was this" or "it was that" at this point would be guesswork :)


on another point yesterday HSE and Terry dunn were standing by the crash site and i asked when will it reopen he said maybe scarefest if not definately next year and he confirmed HSE have finished there investigation and that the only reson they were testing it is to keep the ride running
 
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Thu Aug 13, 2015 3:44 pm

Altonboy001 wrote:
Dan.N wrote:
Altonboy001 wrote:
its human error they put people on while the ride was still in maint.mode


While this is one of the speculated causes of the crash, nothing has yet been released by Merlin or the HSE so to say "it was this" or "it was that" at this point would be guesswork :)


on another point yesterday HSE and Terry dunn were standing by the crash site and i asked when will it reopen he said maybe scarefest if not definately next year and he confirmed HSE have finished there investigation and that the only reson they were testing it is to keep the ride running


Who is Terry Dunn? Sorry if that is a silly question :D
 
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Altonboy001
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Thu Aug 13, 2015 3:48 pm

director of ride operations or something along those lines
 
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lewis97
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Thu Aug 13, 2015 3:52 pm

Terry Dunn is the resort's Head of Technical Services.
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Adam.W
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Thu Aug 13, 2015 5:58 pm

So has the ride started testing again?
 
 
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Dan
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Thu Aug 13, 2015 7:15 pm

homer22422 wrote:
http://www.hse.gov.uk/notices/notices/Notice_details.asp?SF=CN&SV=306419423


This has already been posted a bit further up this page :)
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Fri Aug 14, 2015 10:07 am

Reflecting on my comments, I suppose other rides where serious injury or death have taken place are still open. I certainly think towers need to tread lightly in how they go about, if they go about, reopening it.
 
Owen
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Re: The Smiler Incident 02/06/15

Fri Aug 14, 2015 3:37 pm

I do find it quite unfortunate those who dislike the ride personally are wanting it to be closed expecting it to be replaced with a beloved B&M, which is very unlikely to happen ;)!

Having done the Behind The Scenes tour of this fabulous attraction I can personally say the I feel it is by far the safest ride in the park in terms of the mechanical features. I do unfortunately agree it was constructed badly, however this is not Gerstlauer's fault, this is the fault of the company who assembled the ride. We do not know the reason to why this unfortunate incident occurred but what we do know that it was a freak accident and the way people have been reacting is in my opinion quite childish in some ways. Of course this is the minority of people, and overall I feel the TowersTimes community have handled the incident fairly well.

I do feel sorry for those involved, (as well as the family and friends of the unfortunate Cedar Point victim). At the end of the day, the victims want to move on, Merlin want to move on, so I think it would be best to accept the incident happened and move along with it. Stuff like this happens sometimes it cannot be changed, so come on everyone, just let it go now and be grateful that no fatalities occurred :)
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